Take A Moment Of Reflection.........

[wilky]

This will hopefully provoke some good debate. If it decends into tripe I would ask the Admin gods to spirit it away but I dont think that will be needed.

I put my hand up and admit that in the past I for one have been guilty of driving in a spirited manner unlikely to be embraced by uniformed inhabitants of a certain HQ in Helen St. However I dont push the bubble any more in public, and screw the nut on public roads, if I do decide to progress now its always within the law and to the System. Those of you that know what Im talking about will agree its far safer.

I recently bought a "disposable car" a wee 800cc fiat which wouldnt pull the skin off a custard but which is good for nipping about at work and saves the big car from short trips and carpark dings.

Over the past week I have driven in stealth mode, never broken any motoring laws and clocked up about 500 miles in this car.

Despite being conciderate I have been abused, almost run off the road and had about 7 near misses due to other road users in too much of a hurry.

I havent reacted in normal Wilky style to any of these incidents but mearly made a mental note of them.

When I drive in a similar style in my other car ( Blue S9 bodied JDM STI) I get none of the above.

It makes me think twice now when I see a young woman, old dear, or normal person in a wee car and I give them room at junctions and a chance at roundabouts, on the motorway I always make effort not to break the two second rule, in the big car everyone steers clear, in stealth mode I get everyone right up my hole, especially lorries.

Why does everyone have a vendetta against small cars? And why does everyone have it in for drivers of smaller cars?

I am seriously concidering giving one of these people the shock of thier life, lol. Athough we all know that wouldnt solve anything.

I throw the subject to the shop floor..................................????

Callum W

[st3ph3n]

I'd have said that the reason some people might bully the smaller car is because they can. Simple as that. Why do bullys at school tend to be big and their victims small. Same reason I'd say.

Nicola has a wee Daewoo Matiz and I notice just how different a world you are in when on the roads with it.

I think the fabled "christian motoring" that James May preaches is perhaps something that society needs.

[HairyDJ]

So true!

When the previous wagon got wiped out, I got to drive around in Chrissy's C3 turbo diesel for a few days, and then in a poxy yaris hire car for a couple more weeks.

Same old me at the wheel, driving the same roads etc, but found that so many more other drivers were total gits. About the only good point was the lack of chavs in corsa / nova / golf etc trying to take you on.

I too, found myself being nicer to some of these folk when the new monster was back on the road - trouble is some really aren't capable of being helped by mr nice guy at times.

Wilky - go try it again in a battered old transit and see what the plonkers try on you this time

Cheers, David

[andy]

I recently bought a "disposable car" a wee 800cc fiat which wouldnt pull the skin off a custard but which is good for nipping about at work

How on earth can you cover your several million acre goat estate in an 800cc Fiat? Surely the landed gentry such as yourself would at very least take the Range Rover

I'm currently away for work AGAIN and working in Staffs. Arranged a hire car as it's a fair trek from Brum airport to the hotel and 10 miles from hotel to the customer I'll be spending the next few days with. They've given me one of these...

I feel I should jack in the day job and become a hairdresser...

[wilky]

How on earth can you cover your several million acre goat estate in an 800cc Fiat? Surely the landed gentry such as yourself would at very least take the Range Rover

I'm currently away for work AGAIN and working in Staffs. Arranged a hire car as it's a fair trek from Brum airport to the hotel and 10 miles from hotel to the customer I'll be spending the next few days with. They've given me one of these...

I feel I should jack in the day job and become a hairdresser...

I employ the locals to do these trivial tasks Andrew, they use the Range Rover Sports, normally the Bollinger Paris/Dakar hybrids. I have no idea how many I own, Ill check with my factor. Would you like one?

Edited February 12, 2008 by Wilky

[andy]

I employ the locals to do these trivial tasks Andrew, they use the Range Rover Sports, normally the Bollinger Paris/Dakar hybrids. I have no idea how many I own, Ill check with my factor. Would you like one?

Would I like what? A goat (yes please!), an abused local (possible, but only if they tugged their forelock a lot and said yes m'lud), a Factor or a Range Rover Sport?

[cullenmin]

I too have had this feeling when driving my younger brothers car, a wee C2 1.4.

Its slow as anything and other bigger cars/lorries/vans just seem to bully you. roundabouts/slip roads/junctions. And usually theres nothing you can do to get out the way because your car is just too slow whereas in the scoob (or evo) you can easily pull away and out of the road.

Don't think theres anything you can do except stop and wave a baseball bat in the air...........but you just wouldnt do that

Note: you know I'm joking about the bat

[pmacFTO]

I am forever saying to the wife "If I was in my car they wouldn't have done that" It also makes me a bit more considerate to less powerful cars too as they sometime just have not got enough go to move out your way very quickly so I never hassle people.

I notice it on roundabouts - people may think they'll have a go and pull out in front of the Scenic but they definitely have a 2nd thought about it when they see the Scooby coming.

[thewelsho]

When I was driving the wife's Fiesta (my car was off the road) I felt very much in danger. It wasn't that people were bullying me, it was more to do with the stark difference in the driving experience, in that I was at the mercy of the car's crap performance. Being so used to drving the Scoob, I found the transition a difficult one to handle. it wasn't that I was bullied, it was that I couldn't drive in the manner that I was accustomed too, I was no longer in control. I couldn't pick gaps in the traffic 50 metres down the road to dive into from the outside lane etc. I just had to sit and wait my turn like any normal person. Dare I say it, perhaps this is what you were experiencing and mistook it for being bullied, no?

That aside, I belive myself to be the most curteous driver on the road! So there. I will always let people in, let them pull out, let them skip me in trafic queues etc etc. but that is offset with launches away from lights in the inside lane to get ahead, passing on the inside of idiots who hog the road while going slowly (like

) and dithering muppets who ought not to be within a mile of a car. I can't stand getting stuck behind the 25mph ditherer, so if I have to be a little aggressive to get on, so be it. As I already stated, people who do the same to me, I jsut think "oh well, one day I'll be doing that, no need to get PO'd!

J

[pmacFTO]

I'd give her a wee bit more time to move than that m8 lol - I sometimes move into the inside lane then indicate back out and if they still have not seen me I move back in and gradually go past. Technically it is undertaking but if done without changing down a gear and flooring it, can not be considered dangerous driving.

Plenty guys don't move over too when they see a scooby coming but that's a different reason

I always let people out at junctions etc too and I noticed people tend not not be ready to go and also they don't expect the bloke in the big noisy car to be courteous so it takes me a few flashes before the person believes I am going to let them go!! lol It really bugs me when I flash from a distance so they can come out they just sit and sit untill I have actually come to a standstill - the idea is for them to pull out before I reach them and the traffic can keep flowing.

One thing I have noticed and highlight everytime I am out with the wife - women don't say thanks or wave/flash hazards - guys always do when you let them out.

I also try to anticipate cars wanting to come out of the inside lane on the motorway to go past a lorry etc and I flash them before they even indicate - that is always appreciated by the people I find Oh hang on - am I too considerate to have a powerful motor???

[colzo]

I would tend to agree with St3ph3n on the 'bullying', for instance at traffic calming (when the road turns to single file) and there is no priority given the big 4x4s always think they have the right away over the smaller cars. Maybe a lot of it is down to being courteous but if you`re are late on the school run/work are you going to let a wee car get in your way? On the other side my Mrs wants a X5/Q7 as she thinks she would gain more respect on the road (nothing to do with the marque, only based on the size), I disagree. I feel safer in my car more so for the power I have rather than the size. I think more people could do with being a lot more courteous and I would be up for some sort of driving test resit every 10 years or so.

[jamesm]

I have a 12 year old 106 diesel to commute in and use for the bulk of my business mileage.

I must admit I have always partly thought the opposite. I find people are more courteous towards me. People let me out at junctions, let me filter into queues and are generally more polite towards me. Maybe it is the fact that people see an old battered, smoking 106 heading towards their nice fancy, shiny motor and are more willing to let me in etc as it looks like I couldn’t give a stuff whether I hit anything or not.

What I find however is, like The Welsho, I find I am no longer in control as it is just so slow. I can’t overtake, I get out accelerated by Transit vans and struggled to shake off a bread lorry the other morning. I do find people really sit on my tail when I am trying to accelerate away from, for example, a roundabout in the outside lane, people tailgate me as I am so slow. That is what I don’t like. I get the last laugh though because all the time they are doing that, they are getting a face full of diesel smoke.

The smaller the car the more vulnerable you feel and I would probably look for something a bit bigger for my next cheap commuter.

[mikeyb13]

I have a 12 year old 106 diesel to commute in and use for the bulk of my business mileage.

I must admit I have always partly thought the opposite. I find people are more courteous towards me. People let me out at junctions, let me filter into queues and are generally more polite towards me.

Must admit I would normally agree. Until last week in the wifes focus when there was lying snow on the road I was doing 25 in a 30 zone not slow by any means. Some tadger in a bashed up cavalier was pulling out and in behind me, speeding up slowing down and flashing his lights. It really was quite intimidating so I sped up a bit cause he obviously wasnt going to pass. When we came to a corner I felt the car slide a touch but managed to correct it, I almost crashed because I was scared so what is it like for an pensioner. The bright side is that they went off into a lampost, I dont think Ive ever laughed so much in my life. Dont worry, they were ok judging by the way they chased after my car with what looked like a big stick (possibly due to my post accident hand signals)

[scooby doom]

I would have to agree with most of the comments above, not from too many personal experiences but mainly from listening to my wife every time she comes in from a journey. While she has mainly had smaller cars (Mini, Metro, Golf, AX, Astra, etc) this doesn't seem to be only one factor in being constantly intimidated. She now has a Vectra (well when it runs occasionally) and still finds this happening and puts it down to being a female driver. I'm sure this applies to the elderly as well, although their slow, hesitant, indecisive.. oh, sorry safe driving can't be overlooked.

Now if we get passed the fact that 'women drivers' is a contradiction... wait for it... wait for it... kidding honestly

Unfortunately, there are other factors behind certain driving standards falling below par. As I'm sure most of you know pressures to meet dead lines and timescales at work can often lead to exasperated employees breenging about the country with little regard for others. There are also 'rumours' of transit companies telling their drivers they must meet deadlines and speed etc to meet them. Often these drivers bosses will tell them they'll pay any fines as well. Then there are the roads themselves. this is something we see up here as once you reach Aberdeen travelling north dual carriageways evaporate and motorways are a thing of legend. As the driver that is inevitably late for something having had two or more lanes going the same way you are is great but then you reach the bottle neck that is single lane A class road and suddenly the heavies, volume of traffic and dare I say it agricultural vehicles with orange flashing lights come out of the woodwork... feel ya temperature rising already?

What I get a lot while working is asked "why should I have to.....?" "Why do they.....?" to all manner of issues. When it comes down to it in the perfect world you shouldn't 'have' to do anything and they shouldn't 'do' or 'be allowed to do' whatever. However, unfortunately we live in the real world and in that world these things do happen and will continue to happen despite out best efforts, it's what we do around it without becoming them that makes the difference.

So with the chequered cap on the advice must be.... Do not allow the red mist to fall over your eyes, as you are likely to find that any subsequent retaliation may be dealt with as a road rage incident more harshly than their traffic infringement. Sorry but nor are you likely to be 'the man' and most people have no real perception of the day to day violent culture some elements of society view as normality. Basically, you don't know who they are are what they are capable of - I rest my case with the 1996 incident between Stephen Cameron and Kenneth Noy and the recent events involving Garry Newlove. There are obviously other considerations but if in doubt about any driver especially one following you, slow down, pull in, stop if necessary and let them pass. Or even turn into a side road till they pass by then go back or otherwise rejoin the road you were on and continue. I know and have said above you shouldn't have to but for peace of mind and your potential safety (and that of any family and friends with you) you may just have to.

While not all my professional endeavours in respect of the motorist may be fully appreciated having an acute awareness of this means I can at least try to do something about it. I certainly look out for the intimidating bullies on the road and will give them a tug any time I see them in action. I would also welcome any complaints from motorists about this type of driving and look to trace and deal with them appropriately.

Good topic and some mature thought into replies rather than mere ranting

[wilky]

Some very good replies and advice to one and all.

I especially like the thought that you have no idea about who may be driving the car you have just abused.

Not only for the fact they might be a mentalist, but an incident springs to mind where a member of HM Forces in an unmarked car broke the golden rule and abused another motorist.

The driver and passenger turned out to be the Chief Constable of the PSNI and his aid. To say his feet never touched the floor after that would be an understatement.

[wrxmania]

Some very good replies and advice to one and all.

I especially like the thought that you have no idea about who may be driving the car you have just abused.

Not only for the fact they might be a mentalist, but an incident springs to mind where a member of HM Forces in an unmarked car broke the golden rule and abused another motorist.

The driver and passenger turned out to be the Chief Constable of the PSNI and his aid. To say his feet never touched the floor after that would be an understatement.

All good points made. On the road, size seems to matter - not engine size but car size. Hence the rep in the bottom of the heap vectra shoving everyone out the way - a stereotype I know, but you get the feeling

[frank c]

I must drive around 60K a year and see all sorts when i'm out and about. The amount of cars on the roads these days is unbelievable never mind the way people go about themselves. Everyone seems to be in a hurry to get nowhere so common sense and good manners just go out the window. SADLY.

The worst part for me is when I get abuse from other drivers when they are clearly at fault or just not paying attention . They are quite happy sitting in the car , blethering away to their mates or on the phone holding everyone up or just being a nuisance on the road to see what's really going on around them. I've lost count of the amount of times I've stopped to let someone out or similar just for them to drive right passed me and not let on or say thanks..clearly these folk think the road is just for them or am i missing something .

Don't they realise they are a danger to themselves, never mind anyone else..

I don't see there's much difference between big cars, small cars, vans or trucks tbh.. If your a bad driver , your a bad driver in my book.

Common courtesy and Good manners are FREE. They just don't get used enough !

[plsteve]

It doesn't seem to matter what car you in up Aberdeenshire way. Everyone is in a rush and some really bad drivers.

In the last 2 days, I have had someone trying to overtake me driving through a very quiet village when I was bang on 30. Needless to say I accellerated so he couldnt pass, when he pulled in behind me I hit the brakes hard to slow back to 30 - making him almost go into the back of me - so needless to say I got the old flashing of headlights and hand gestures. If you are in that much of a rush leave fcuking earlier and stop being a tw@t when there are schoolkids going about.

Then today, coming towards Banchory on my way to Aberdeen I overtake a Landie at 40, only for someone to follow right up my a***. Couldnt make out the car though. Continued following me rather closely and overtook me when I was cruising at 60. Only to join a chain of cars in front. of course driving through the 30 zone I lost sight of him as he sped through at about 50 I reckon, again at a time when kids could be about. What made it worse was it was a classic green impreza bein driven by a wee mucker - no SIDC stickers though.

It's my pet hate on the roads, people not observing the speed limits in built up areas. Oh and the women drivers who only know 1 speed, 40mph no matter where they are A roads or built up 30 zones.

Steve.

[iainc]

It doesn't seem to matter what car you in up Aberdeenshire way. Everyone is in a rush and some really bad drivers.

In the last 2 days, I have had someone trying to overtake me driving through a very quiet village when I was bang on 30. Needless to say I accellerated so he couldnt pass, when he pulled in behind me I hit the brakes hard to slow back to 30 - making him almost go into the back of me - so needless to say I got the old flashing of headlights and hand gestures. If you are in that much of a rush leave fcuking earlier and stop being a tw@t when there are schoolkids going about.

Then today, coming towards Banchory on my way to Aberdeen I overtake a Landie at 40, only for someone to follow right up my a***. Couldnt make out the car though. Continued following me rather closely and overtook me when I was cruising at 60. Only to join a chain of cars in front. of course driving through the 30 zone I lost sight of him as he sped through at about 50 I reckon, again at a time when kids could be about. What made it worse was it was a classic green impreza bein driven by a wee mucker - no SIDC stickers though.

It's my pet hate on the roads, people not observing the speed limits in built up areas. Oh and the women drivers who only know 1 speed, 40mph no matter where they are A roads or built up 30 zones.

Steve.

Know exactly what you mean... lost count of the number of cars that flash you if you dare to overtake them out in the sticks, only to be right up yer *rse thru' the next village 'cos you are observing the limit and they're still going at 55mph.

I try not to let it bother me now and just let them get on with it and hopefully not involve me in their accident.

[thefastone]

Yeah I know exactly what your talking about like, Ive had a lot of very different experiences on the roads up until now, but one thing that Ive been noticeing in the past year especially, is that the manners have gone, well and truely, I always wave if someone lets me out, of if they do me a good turn, I'll even wave sometimes if I have right of way, as you know, some of the other muppets dont know about right of way and try to muscle though anyways, so if they have not been Crap about it, then I'll say thanks...

Dont get me wrong, you get the occasional wave from the odd car that I let out, but thats few and far between...

And yeah, ive had a lot of times that Ive been holding back, becasue I know the road comming up, and I know that theres traffic ahead, theres no way that I could go fast there, so ive not pushed, only to be harrassed by some other who obviously knows better...

and You know, Ive noticed, that the worst drivers for aggression on the roads, have been the likes of the Vectras, and the Citroen Lagunas, and also the Ford mondeos.... the ones that think that they have big fast cars... and gives them licence to drive however they like...

Although that Green Classic, I remember that Simmie was wanting a lookout kept for one of them that has be really been a pest around town... has been cutting up and gennerally driving dangerously, seem to remember that it was a young lad too...

All this has really been food for thought for me, Ive recently been around a few garages looking for small cars for the missus when she passes her test, Toyota Aygo, VW Fox, Fiat 500 etc, Ive had test drives in all of them, on different roads, and cant say that I've really had any of those problems, but that was only one day, I dare say that theres still room for those problems... this just makes me worry more about her learning to drive...

[gus the bus]

well, as many of you know my EVERY DAY car is a wee C1 and the Mrs has one too (Matchin book ends ) but i havent really come across the problem as tbh the C1 is so nippy folk get p'd off with being left behind at the lights, junctions and roundabouts etc.... although you do get folk trying to beat you to a slip rd off motorways etc.... as they think you are going to be slow.

I just close the gap and really F**k them off

But I'm sure for a lot of drivers on the Rd's this is sadly a real problem

[plsteve]

All this has really been food for thought for me, Ive recently been around a few garages looking for small cars for the missus when she passes her test, Toyota Aygo, VW Fox, Fiat 500 etc, Ive had test drives in all of them, on different roads, and cant say that I've really had any of those problems, but that was only one day, I dare say that theres still room for those problems... this just makes me worry more about her learning to drive...

I can appreciate that - my girlfriend learning to drive just now. We bought a little Clio for her to learn in, but even with the L plates on people are tailing and not being very considerate. I was considering changing it for another little run about, she has had her eye on a Yaris or something similar. But I convinced her to get a small 4x4, due to other drivers attitudes to small cars. I would be much happier with her in a RAV4 or a LandRover.

Steve.